June 11, 2010
There is a reason for everything that happens.
If it werent for the 2005 trial we wouldnt have
a chance now to read MACAULEY CULKINS testimony of
May 12, 2005 which is a complete masterpiece and is probably
the best thing the actor has done since his great Home
The media usually refers to this testimony in one sentence only
Culkin denies abuse, but it surely deserves
much more attention especially when taken in combination with
the words of witnesses for the prosecution who spoke against
Culkin at the 2005 trial. These include former Neverland employees
Adrian McManus and Phillip Lemarque. McManus,
who worked as a maid, told jurors that she saw Jackson once
kiss Culkin on the cheek while he had his hand kind of
by his leg, kind of on his rear end.
Lemarque provided more graphic testimony. The former
Neverland majordomo claimed that he saw Jackson fondle Culkin
while the pair played a video game in Neverlands arcade
sometime in 1991 (Culkin was 10 or 11 at the time).
Well, guys, it is a great pleasure to introduce to you the government
witness Phillip Lemarque who claimed to have seen the
molestation process in its most vivid detail.
The Smoking Gun says about him: Along with his wife Stella
Marcroft, Phillip Lemarque worked at Neverland for a brief period
in the early 90s (the couple says their Jackson employment,
which ended around late-1991, lasted two years, while other
accounts put their tenure at 10 months). It was during that
time, Lemarque has told investigators, that he witnessed Jackson
act inappropriately with Culkin and other boys.
Lemarque (now 74) is a French expat who once wrote of
his and his wifes Neverland responsibilities, Stella
was Michael Jacksons private chef, I was the major dhomo
in charge of organizing Michaels entertainment activities.
After both of them were fired by Jacksons aide Norma Staikos
in 1991 Lemarque opened an Encino restaurant in Bourbon Street
but amassed $455,000 in debt through his operation of it. It
was during his personal bankruptcy proceeding that he
was peddling a Jackson molestation tale.
Philippe and Stella Lemarque first reached out to a supermarket
tabloid in 1991 but the story wasnt published then. While
looking for the right media channel the Lemargues were not above
tailoring their story to fit their needs. They initially asked
$100100 claiming they saw MJ sexually caress young visitors
including Macauley Culkin. As their asking price rose the story
changed. When their price increased to $500000 Michaels
hand moved into Culkins pants.
The couple contacted former porn star Paul Barresi to aid them
in selling it to a London tabloid. Barresi admitted he
didnt care if the tale was true he was just helping
them to sell it because he was promised a percentage of the
selling price. Barresi himself pulled an end-around on the couple,
selling their story to the Globe after surreptitiously taping
a meeting during which the pair laid out their charges against
Jackson (the resulting piece was headlined We Saw Michael
Molesting Child Star.)
According to the Smoking Gun Lemarque later turned into a master
authority on Internet porn running a hardcore web site
stocked with video and photos depicting nudity and heterosexual,
bi-sexual, homosexual, and transsexual situations. In
1997, he launched Virtual Sin web site (billed as the
most sinful site on the internet) which he operated until
In addition to Virtual Sin, Lemarque also operated Galaxy
2001, a how-to site for wannabe online porn operators. Selling
SEX is not difficult if you know how to manage your boat through
the intricacies of the Internet, noted Lemarque. He claimed
that Galaxy 2001 doubled as a web host and housed hundred
of adult web sites on its servers.
Among the porn tutorials sold by Lemarque was one offering instruction
on how to shoot your own sex videos. The site also contained
a flashing link with the words TEENS TEENS TEENS
that went to another Lemarque site where the X-rated photos
featured women clearly beyond 19. (Full story on Lemarque:
. so this was the man who testified against
Jackson and said he had seen him act inappropriately with Culkin
and other boys? What a reckless thing to do was to employ him
at all! Though he was surely hired by Michaels assistants,
Well, at least they saw through him after 10
months of his employment
. I can VERY well imagine what
stuff he could have left at Neverland to be later picked up
by the police as Michaels belongings
I COULDNT BELIEVE WHAT THEY WERE SAYING ABOUT
Here are only some excerpts from Macauley Culkins cross-examination
by Ronald Zonen and Tom Mesereau (even this way it is really
long!) The full transcript is here:
Reporter´S Transcript .
Q. How long has he been a friend of yours?
A. I first met him when I was 9 or 10 years old.
Q. And how did you meet him?
A. He kind of called me out of the blue one time, just said,
Hey, you know, This is Michael Jackson.
And this is after the Home Alone movie had come
out. So its kind of like it was like, I think
I understand kind of whats happening, and Id like
to get together and talk.
Q. And hes still your friend?
A. Yes, he is. Q. When did you
visit Neverland for the first time?
A. It was after he had called that first time. He invited us,
me and my family, over there to hang out.
Q. And did you and your family go to Neverland?
A. Yes, we did.
Q. Did you hang out?
A. Yes, we did.
Q. How long did you hang out there with him?
A. I think the first trip we were there for about three or four
days. It was me and my younger brother and my mother and my
Q. How many times do you think you visited Neverland?
A. More than a dozen times from basically when I was about 10
to when I was about 14 years old. When I first when I
first went there, it was such an amazing place, that I decided
to you know, any opportunity I had to go out there, I
Q. Okay. And what do you remember about your first visit to
A. It was big. It was it was I had never seen
anything like it before. Especially considering it was someones
house. And he was a nice guy. I remember he laughed because
I referred to all the Ninja Turtles by their first names, and
things like that. And so it was one of those kind of things
where it was just very it was very casual, really.
Q. What are some of the things you did at Neverland with your
A. Saw a movie in the movie theater. Rode on the amusement park
rides, and just everything, you know. Just used the facilities,
Q. How many times do you think your family has been to Neverland?
A. About the same amount of times. When I was younger they were
there virtually every time I was there.
Q. Have you seen Michael Jackson outside of Neverland?
Q. Where have you seen him?
A. Whenever. Id be staying at a hotel and hed come
and pick me and my brothers up, and wed sneak into a movie
theater like in the middle of the night in the middle
of, like, you know, a movie, because that was the only way you
could really see an actual movie in an actual movie theater
with him. Just a number of occasions.
A. He was in London when I was out there doing a play. And he
was out there for, I dont know, maybe a week or so. We
hung out two times, three times.
Q. Now, in London, what did you do with Michael Jackson?
A. Hung out with his kids. We had we had a dinner with
a group of people, most of whom I had not met before, but just
it was a nice, casual, sit-down dinner. And just saw
the kids, things like that. I always liked seeing the kids.
Q. And youre talking about Michaels kids?
Q. You heard about some of the allegations about whether or
not Mr. Jackson improperly ever touched you, right?
Q. Did Mr. Jackson ever molest you?
Q. Did Mr. Jackson ever improperly touch you?
A. Absolutely not.
Q. Has Mr. Jackson ever touched you in any sexual type of way?
Q. Has he ever touched you in any offensive way? A. No.
Q. What do you think of these allegations?
A. I think theyre absolutely ridiculous.
Q. When did you first learn that these prosecutors were claiming
that you were improperly touched?
A. When did I first learn that?
A. I somebody called me up and said, You should
probably check out CNN, because theyre saying something
Q. And did you check it out?
A. Yes, I did.
Q. And what did you learn?
A. I learned that it was a former cook had done something to
me, and there was something about a maid or something like that.
It was just one of those things where I just couldnt believe
it. I couldnt believe that, first of all, these people
were saying these things or let alone that it was out
there and people were thinking that kind of thing about me.
And at the same time it was amazing to me that they that
nobody approached me and even asked me whether or not the allegations
were true. They kind of just were threw it out there
just like they didnt even they didnt
even double-check it basically. I mean, even if they assumed
that they knew the answer, what got me was that they didnt
Q. Now, are you saying these prosecutors never tried to reach
you to ask you your position on this?
A. No, they didnt.
Q. Do you know if any police officer from Santa Barbara has
ever tried to call you to see what the truth is?
Q. Have you ever been to Michael Jacksons bedroom?
Q. And when did you first see Michael Jacksons bedroom?
A. I think it was probably the first trip.
Q. And did you go in there with your family?
Q. And what do you recall about Michael Jacksons room?
A. It was large. It was it was a very comfortable place.
He had paintings and all those kind of things on the wall. It
was you know, it had two bedrooms and it was two stories
high. It was you know, its not what you normally
associate with a bedroom.
Q. And have you and your family stayed in that room?
Q. How many times, do you think?
A. Handful of times.
Q. How about your brother?
A. Whenever I was there, my little brother was kind of always
tagging along with me, so he was usually anywhere I was.
Q. Where else at Neverland have you been with Michael Jackson?
A. Everywhere, essentially. We were always hanging out together,
just like I said, and using all the facilities; the zoo, the
arcade, or the movie theater, wherever.
Q. What have you done with him?
A. Like I said, we used everything. Wed play video games.
We would fill up a bunch of water balloons and toss them around.
Just things like that. It was just good old fun, just like a
bunch of, like, kids basically having a good time.
Q. What time of day would you play video games with Mr. Jackson?
A. Anytime. You know, sometimes I mean, sometimes I fell
asleep in the arcade and Id wake up and just start playing,
you know. It was one of those kind of things where, you know,
youd be up half the night, youd be you know,
youd be kind of in and out of all these places.
Q. Did you ever get the feeling that your family was being excluded
from anything you did at Neverland?
A. Absolutely not
.It was a real open-door policy just
with the entire ranch.
Q. That applied to your family as well as you?
A. Yes, everyone.
Q. Youre complaining that we didnt interview you?
A. Im just saying it was something that I said
I kind of just all of a sudden I turn on the television
or look on the Internet and there was those things out there,
and it was just surprising to me.
Q. Mr. Culkin, are you completely unaware of the fact that law
enforcement has made a number of efforts to gain access to you
to talk to you?
A. Like I said, Im unaware.
Q. Okay. Have you ever traveled with Michael Jackson?
Q. Where did you travel to?
A. We took a trip, I was going with some family friends. We
were going to Bermuda, and I said, Were going.
And he said, Is it all right if I tag along? And
I said, Yes. So we did that. After that, we ended
up in we decided to fly back to Orlando, because the
family friends that I was traveling with, thats where
they were from. So we went there, went to Disney World for a
day or two, and ended up flying back with my family.
Q. And did Mr. Jackson ever do anything improper to you on any
of these trips?
Q. Ever see him do anything that you found disturbing on any
of these trips?
A. Absolutely not.
Q. Has Mr. Jackson ever hugged you?
Q. Have you ever hugged him?
Q. Were you ever suspicious of any of these hugs as being something
sexual in nature?
A. No, it was always very casual. It was just the way I hug
any of my friends.
Q. Did you ever see Mr. Jackson hug your sister?
Q. Were you ever suspicious of his hugging your sister?
Q. Ever see Mr. Jackson hug your brothers?
Q. Ever see them hug him?
Q. Did you ever think anything suspicious was going on when
your brothers hugged Mr. Jackson?
A. No, it was always just how you kind of greeted him, greeted
almost anyone basically that you were close with.
Q. When he got there, he gave you a watch, did he not?
A. I think thats when he gave me the watch.
Q. It was a Rolex?
Q. He gave a Rolex to an 11-year-old child?
A. Yeah. But it wasnt it wasnt anything all
that crazy to me. I didnt see it as anything like that.
I was not a person without means, so it wasnt anything
that was all that awe-inspiring. I mean, my father had a Rolex.
It was that kind of thing.
Q. Youre an 11-year-old child, but you felt it was okay
to invite Mr. Jackson to attend a trip that you were going on
with another family?
A. Yeah. I mean, and they were fine with it, from what I remember.
Q. Was it your belief that he was there to visit with you?
A. Yeah, to visit, and spend some time in Bermuda.
Q. All right. And to spend a week or more with a ten-year-old
A. To spend a week or more with me, yes.
Q. Prior to staying in Bermuda, had you ever spent the night
alone with Mr. Jackson?
A. How do you mean spend the night?
Q. Did you ever share a bed with Mr. Jackson prior to going
A. Yeah, I mean, Id fallen asleep in the same bed as him.
Q. Did you ever do that, fall asleep in the same bed as Mr.
Jackson prior to going to Bermuda where none of your brothers
or sisters were present?
A. Its possible. But like I said, usually my brother was
tagging along with me. But I fell asleep basically everywhere
in that ranch, or anywhere else when I was hanging out with
him. I would just flop down on the floor half the time.
Q. Mr. Culkin, the question was, did you ever share a bed with
Q. the two of you by yourself, prior to going to Bermuda?
A. If I remember correctly, probably, yes.
Q. On approximately how many occasions did you and Mr. Jackson
share a bed the entire night prior to going to Bermuda?
A. A handful of times.
Q. Was it your expectation that while in Bermuda you would be
sharing a hotel room and a bed with Mr. Jackson?
A. I dont remember it being like an expectation. It was
I may have fallen asleep in the same bed with him there,
but it was just as likely Id fall asleep on the couch
Q. You might have fallen asleep in the bed with Mr. Jackson
A. I might have fallen asleep on his bed, yes.
Q. All right. On how many of those occasions were you there
by yourself without any sibling, alone, without any sibling
A. I dont really remember. But most every time I was there,
I was there with my siblings. And most every time I was with
my siblings, they were, like, with me the entire time.
Q. In fact, none of your brothers ever shared a bed with Mr.
Jackson by themselves either, did they?
A. Im not sure if thats true. But I dont I
dont know. Sometimes I would I wouldnt fall
asleep. Id be up for a little bit longer and, you know,
my brothers would fall asleep who knows where.
Q. But there were occasions when you went to Neverland without
your siblings and without your parents; is that right?
A. I think I took one trip there where I arrived there before
my family did, for like a day or two, and then they showed up.
Q. Up until the age of, say, 14, are you telling us every time
you went to Neverland you were with your parents and your siblings?
A. In some kind of combination of siblings and parents, yes.
Q. You never once went to Neverland by yourself?
A. Like I said, I think I showed up I showed up there
once, and it was like a day or two and then my family met me
A. It would be I slept in his room about as often as
I fell asleep anywhere. Like, I fell asleep I would flop
down wed fall asleep in the movie theater. He has
beds in the movie theater. Id flop down and fall asleep
there. Ive fallen asleep in the video game machines before.
I mean, Ive I would go and play there basically
until Id just run myself out, and I would just flop down
wherever I needed to.
Q. And youd be pretty exhausted and go fast asleep; is
A. Yeah, I mean, that would happen. Id wear myself out
and fall asleep, just like any kid would.
Q. While you were asleep as a nine-year-old kid who had run
himself ragged, you wouldnt know what happened while you
were asleep, right?
A. I find that unlikely.
Q. Well, but you just told us that sometimes youd be so
exhausted after a day of playing youd fall asleep on a
A. Yeah, but I think Id realize if something like that
was happening to me.
Q. Yes? And on many of those occasions, you would fall asleep
in his bed?
A. It would happen.
Q. So you would have no recollection at all, of all of your
visits to Neverland, of ever actually making arrangements to
simply go to bed like anybody else, putting on pajamas and crawling
into bed and turning out the light?
A. I never really wore pajamas. But at the same time, it was
something like I mean, occasionally, yeah, Id have
to like, wed have to wake up early in the morning
because for whatever reason, because Id have to
because we were going to be leaving in the morning or
whatever. I mean, sometimes I was put on a schedule.
Q. Mr. Culkin, as a nine-year-old child, what did you wear to
A. I wore my clothes.
Q. You would just wear whatever you were wearing during the
Q. Every single night?
A. Up until I was about 17 years old. Thats when I kind
of discovered what pajamas were.
Q. And you did that at home as well?
Q. Whatever you were wearing?
A. I always fell asleep in jeans and socks and a T-shirt.
Q. All right. So whenever you were at Neverland, you would crawl
into bed in jeans and socks and a T-shirt?
Q. How old were you when you stopped sleeping in bed with Michael
A. Well, like I said, I stopped going there just because I had
really I had never really found myself going to Los Angeles
or anything like that. So I didnt really come back again
until I was about 17.
Q. The question was, when did you stop sleeping
A. I know. Im getting there. And so when I got
when I started coming back again, I found myself just not sleeping
in bed. And Ive always kind of fell asleep in the guest
units ever since then.
Q. Why didnt you stay with Mr. Jackson in his room?
A. Because I enjoyed my privacy a little bit more.
Q. All right. So is it safe to say that up until and through
your 13th year, you stayed with Mr. Jackson in his room?
A. On occasion On occasion Id fall asleep there
or wherever. It wasnt really like a thing to, like, Lets
go to sleep in a particular place. On occasion Id
end up falling asleep there. Id fall asleep anywhere.
Q. Did he tell you how close he felt to you?
A. Yeah, and Im trying to explain
THE COURT: You dont need to explain.
A. Okay. I understand. Yeah, we were close.
Q. Did he start telling you about seeing you as family early
on in your relationship with him?
A. I dont know how far into the relation or friendship
it was, that we started talking about how close we felt. But
it was definitely something where we understood each other early
Q. Even when you were nine years old?
A. Because of circumstances, yes.
Q. Did he give gifts to your parents?
A. I think so. But I honestly dont remember. This is a
while ago. But he was he was very generous. He always
gave gifts to everybody.
Q. Were you ever introduced to Jordie Chandler?
A. I couldnt say. I met handfuls of people kind of going
in and out. There was always kind of a revolving door of staff
and of people kind of coming in. Sometimes there would be guests
there that I had never really met before or things like that.
Q. Were you ever in Mr. in Mr. Jacksons bedroom
overnight while another boy was present in that room, other
than your brothers?
A. On occasion, the other kids there that like I said,
some of them were introduced like, I was introduced to
as, like, cousins or family friends and stuff like that. And
theyd bring their kids there, and then same as
me. They would they would play with me, and wed
fall asleep anywhere, sometimes his bedroom, sometimes in the
theater, sometimes anywhere.
Q. How many nights do you believe you spent alone in Michael
Jacksons room and in his bed, alone with Michael Jackson,
between the ages of 9, 10 and 14?
A. It couldnt have been more than like it was a
handful of times. It couldnt have been more than, like,
five times, four times.
Q. All right. After age 10, from age 11 through 14, how many
times do you think you went to Neverland?
A. From 10 to 14? Like, six to eight times.
Q. And of those six to eight times, how many times of those
did you spend in his let me redo that again. Six to eight
times doesnt necessarily mean six to eight nights, does
A. No, I would sometimes I would stay for a weekend,
sometimes it would be Id try to get up there
even if it was for a day, Id go up there. But sometimes
it would be, like, four days, sometimes five days.
Q. Whats the longest you ever stayed at Neverland?
A. When I was I think I was 20, I stayed there for about,
I dont know, 10 days, 14 days. And that was the longest
trip Id ever taken there.
Q. At age 20?
Q. All right. Well, can I assume that at age 20 you were not
sleeping with Michael Jackson?
A. I dont think he was there on that trip. I kind of just
said, I need to relax. Is it okay if I use your house?
And he said, Sure. I was just staying there by myself,
and Id just stay in the guest units, and it was just
it was just that. He wasnt even there.
Q. But even at age 20, you would not have been sleeping with
him in any event; is that correct?
A. Probably not. Like I said, you know, as you get older, you
start enjoying your privacy and you start getting on more of
a schedule. And I was falling asleep on I had more of
a schedule going.
Q. Have you slept with Mr. Jackson since you turned 20?
Q. Did you ever spend a night in Mr. Jacksons bedroom
with another boy, not your brothers?
A. Sometimes. Sometimes, like I said, there would be kids there.
Theyd be introduced as cousins or something like that.
And they would hang with us, just as much as anyone else would.
Q. Can you describe any of them?
A. They were kids. They were you know, some of them had
dark hair. Darker skin, that kind of thing. Whenever I was around,
sometimes there would be other kids around. And, you know, it
wasnt like we all, like, Oh, its time to go
to bed. Lets huddle in. Its like, you know, youre
chatting in bed, and the next thing you know youre asleep.
Q. Did Mr. Jackson ever take you on shopping sprees?
A. Yeah, wed go shopping.
A. We used to do this thing where in the middle of the night
not necessarily the middle of the night, but around,
like, after the stores had closed, he would arrange for us to
go to Toys-R-Us. And sometimes he wouldnt even arrange
it. We would go there, and hed literally knock on the
door, and the janitor would drop his mop, and go, What
the heck? and let us in. And then theyd you
know, wed go shopping basically at Toys-R-Us when the
store was totally empty, because its the only time that
he could really go shopping like that.
Q. How many times did he do that with you?
A. Oh, gosh. Like two times, three times
Q. Did you ever have a conversation with your parents prior
to the age of 13? In other words, 12 or younger. While you were
12 years of age or younger, did you ever have a conversation
with either of your parents about whether or not you should
be sharing a bed with Michael Jackson?
A. No. They never really saw it as an issue.
Q. Did they know that you were sleeping in his bed?
A. I assume so.
Q. You assume so?
A. I cant tell you what they what they knew or
didnt know or what they thought or didnt think.
Q. Can we assume from that your parents never came into the
room while you were in bed with Michael Jackson?
A. Thats not true, no. Sometimes my father would wake
us up, because he liked going horseback riding or something
like that and, you know, things that I didnt necessarily
enjoy as much as he did, but he would wake me up early in the
morning to go horseback riding.
Q. And you would be in bed alone with Michael Jackson?
A. Not always alone, no. And sometimes I wouldnt be always
there. I would be wherever. But I knew they knew that I was
in that room, and they knew I fell asleep there.
Q. Did your father say anything to Michael Jackson about him
sharing a bed with his ten-year-old son? Did he say anything
to Michael Jackson about that in your presence at that time?
A. No, it was a very casual thing. So, no, he never really said
Q. The answer is No?
A. No, he never said anything.
Q. Did your mother ever come into the room when you were alone
with Michael Jackson in bed?
A. Its a possibility, yeah.
Q. Do you remember the first time that happened?
A. No, not really, not in any specific detail.
Q. Do you know if it happened more than once?
A. Yeah. He had a very open-door policy. His bedroom door at
that time was never locked. Anyone could walk in, fall asleep
there, Id fall asleep anywhere. People just kind of fell
asleep wherever they wanted to. That was kind of the fun of
the place, was that there was no rigid rules about when or where
you should fall asleep.
Q. Did you share a bed with any other 35-year-old man other
than a relative during your adolescence?
A. Not that I remember, but I wasnt really friends with
a lot of 35-year-olds who actually understood me.
Q. You said that Michael Jackson understood you. What did you
A. Well, because of circumstances, like with my career, I mean,
one day I was essentially a normal kid who happened to be an
actor, and the next thing I know, Im just this thing where
people are hiding in the bushes and trying to take your picture.
And just people are kind of out to profit from you, or
next thing you know you have a million acquaintances and no
more friends anymore. It was like that. And he understood that.
That was one of the first things we talked about, was dont
I get it. I understand what youre going through.
I understand the same thing. You know, If you want
to talk about anything or if you ever want to you
know, I could learn from his knowledge, basically, of where
he came from. And you couldnt really find a whole lot
of people, especially when youre nine years old, put in
these circumstances that nobody else you cant really
talk to anybody about this kind of stuff. And he understood
it, and it was it was a comforting thing.
Q. Do you still talk to Mr. Jackson about the unique way child
actors develop and live?
A. On occasion. Its not like its, you know, a child
performer self-help group or something like that. But at the
same time, it was we still talk about it, because were
a part of a unique group of people. And so we have a unique
understanding of one another. And when it goes to any person
who is a child performer, I kind of keep an eye out for them,
and I because I get it. And it goes the same for anyone
who, you know, was or, you know, is a child performer. I think
you kind of keep an eye out. You have an understanding of them.
Q. When you say he gets it, what do you mean, specifically?
A. Well, like I said, like the photographers in the bushes,
or just profiteers, people looking to out to get you
kind of thing. And he he lived through that before. And
so he understood what what it was like to be put in a
position that I was in, basically just thrust into that position.
And its weird. It wasnt necessarily anything I chose
for myself. It was something that kind of just happened, and
now I have to deal with it. And he understood that.
Q. Did you ever see Mr. Jackson as very childlike himself?
A. He was very childlike, yes.
Q. What do you mean?
A. He liked doing the things that we liked to do. He liked playing
the arcade games. Though he wasnt as good as us, usually,
but, you know, he still enjoyed doing it, because, you know,
it was one of those things. And he enjoyed the same kind of
movies. He liked running around. We used to play tag. I mean,
its that kind of thing. He played with us, you know, the
same kind of way I played with any of my friends my age.
Q. Did Mr. Jackson and you ever discuss the problem of sort
of missing out on your childhoods because of all the work and
pressures of success?
A. It was one of those things that we talked about, yeah. It
just it kind of just comes with the territory. Like I
said, its not really, you know, its not really a
therapy kind of thing. Its just kind of more like occasionally
we would just kind of talk about those kind of things, yes.
Q. And you talked about an open-door policy in his room.
Q. Could you please explain what you mean?
A. Well, no doors were ever really locked in his place. It wasnt
like you know, you could always you could always
come he always told me, You can just come to the
ranch whenever you want. And every door was open, and
you can go anywhere you wanted, and that included the bedroom.
Q. And did you feel that adults were free to come in and out
as well as children?
A. Absolutely. He had a lot of memorabilia and things like that
in his closets, and so people liked to look at that. It was
one of those stops on the tour when we first showed up. Its
like, Come to the bedroom. Come see whats in the
closet, those kind of things. Like I said, its almost
a part of the tour.
Q. What what other shopping sprees did he take you on,
if you remember?
A. I think one time when I was I mean, besides the Toys-R-Us
kind of things, that we just kind of show up in the middle of
the night and scare the janitor, I think when I was about 17
or 18, he was in town with Prince, and we went to he
closed down FAO Schwartz, like, late at night, and we kind of
showed up there and shopped a little there. And anywhere he
shops, they kind of have to close it down for him, or we have
to go late at night, just because it just kind of comes
with the territory. So I think we also went CD or DVD shopping
when we were in London. He was just like, Were going
to go shopping. Do you want to tag along? And I went,
Sure. Q. And the prosecutor asked you questions
about whether you felt Mr. Jackson was somehow pressuring you
somehow to do something improper. Did you ever feel as if Mr.
Jackson was pressuring you to do anything?
A. He never pressured me to do anything at all. Just
he was just my friend. He never really pressured me to do anything.
Not even go to sleep at the right time or eat my vegetables,
Q. Did you see Mr. Jackson allow other children and families
into his room?
A. Yeah. It was, you know, whenever it was like
I said, it was an open-door policy, not only for me but for
whatever other families were there.
Q. And had you discussed with Mr. Jackson from time to time
those false allegations?
A. Not really. Its not something we necessarily talk about.
Its its you know, I think its just
a painful subject. It was a hard thing for everyone to go through,
I mean especially him. It just its a hard subject.
Q. Did you ever consider making false allegations against Mr.
Jackson so you could get money?
A. Absolutely not.
Q. Did you ever even imagine doing such a thing?
Q. Youre telling us that Mr. Jackson had no problem with
people going through the closets in his bedroom?
A. Yeah, it was one of those things. I mean, I dont necessarily
think it was a good thing to rifle through everything, but it
Q. But people did?
A. He had a large closet. Like I said, he had a lot of his old
rhinestone jackets and things like that in there.
Q. People did that?
A. People would go in there, yes.
Q. Sometimes people he didnt even know?
A. Well, I cant really speak of whether or not they knew
him or not. I assumed if they were there, they knew him.
Q. Certainly people who were in his room with his permission
had his permission as well to go through the closets and look
at the memorabilia in his closets; is that right?
A. Sure. Like I said, it was another stop on the tour. It was
another kind of thing.
Q. It would be nothing unusual at all about somebody who was
in his room with his permission to go through his closets and
A. Well, I wouldnt necessarily say the drawers. But it
was kind of more one of the closets was a lot
definitely a lot more for display than it was for, you know,
Q. You said he was childlike. Are you referring to his behavior
back when you were 10 and 11 years old?
A. Yeah. I mean, even now, hes more of a father now. Its
kind of fun for me to see that. But at the same time, yeah,
I mean, he still has childlike qualities.
Q. Do you believe that his possession of a great deal of sexually
explicit material is consistent with him being childlike?
A. How do you mean?
Q. Him possessing a lot of magazines that are very sexually
A. It depends on what you are talking about. When I was 12 or
13 years old, I had a couple of Playboys under my bed.
Q. How about magazines that depict men and women engaged in
sex acts, magazines with men
Would you believe that possession
of those kinds of magazines, and a number of them, would it
be consistent with or inconsistent with his being childlike?
A. Well, I think I dont think theres anything
wrong with having those things, whether youre childlike
or not. I mean, overall, hes still a human being, and
its something that human beings possess. And so I dont
really necessarily find that inappropriate. But but,
yeah, I dont find it inappropriate.
Q. But its surprising to you that he would be in possession
of all of that; is that right?
A. Not necessarily, no.
Macaulay Culkin Testimony
A strict disciplinarian would naturally find it appalling
that there was no time schedule for going to bed in Neverland
and that its guests would fall asleep while watching films in
Or that they would drop asleep wherever and whenever
they wanted and in their daytime clothes too. Or that they would
go to the movies or shopping late at night and have a
shop opened specially for them.
Or that Michaels bedroom would actually be a common sitting
room where everyone would enter any time they wanted and with
its closets being open to everyone willing to rake through his
belongings (which was a very reckless thing to do, in
Im happy that Macaulay Culkin is a guy who is really no
different in his real life from the character of his Home
Alone movies. It would be amusing to see what a child
like that would have done to anyone if he had ever tried to
touch him inappropriately.
I am very thankful to Macaulay Culkin for his unique
character, his courage to defy public opinion and
his desire to tell the truth about the innocent fun of being
a guest of Michael Jackson.
Here is a great article showing what Michaels and Culkins
holiday was like when they were Bermuda (the one which the prosecution
tried to make out as something really sinister):
A Familys Bermuda Vacation Was Transformed by Michael
By Tamara Jones
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, May 19, 2005
Alan Goldstein and his wife, Lynn, remember they were busy getting
ready to take a nice family vacation with their youngest son,
Brock, and his best pal, Mac, when they overheard Brock on the
phone with Mac, saying something to the effect of yeah, sure,
bring him along, too.
This is how pop superstar Michael Jackson appeared at their
hotel in Bermuda with a bandage on his nose, a shy smile on
his famous face, and a trunkful of squirt guns, race cars and
stink bombs on his bed in the VIP suite.
Nice to meet you, the Goldsteins said, or something to that
Fourteen years have passed, but like some postcard from the
edge, the Goldsteins vacation has now come under the scrutiny
of 12 strangers sitting in a California jury box.
And once again, Michael Jackson has popped into the lives of
a hotel executive, his teacher wife and their son, now a 24-year-old
bartender who finds it all just so crazy. But what
the jury in Jacksons child molestation trial recently
heard about that week in Bermuda and what the Goldsteins remember
prove to be two entirely different stories: One evokes the image
of a creepy predator using a gold Rolex to bait a starstruck
kid; the other, of a lonely celebrity trying to reclaim a forsaken
childhood by lobbing water balloons at tourists.
The surreal island idyll began when Brock Goldstein, a sometime
actor in Orlando, met Macaulay Culkin on a movie set and the
two 10-year-olds became fast friends. After his hit Home
Alone was released that year, Mac Culkin made another
new friend, as well: Michael Jackson.
That sounds like fun. Mind if I tag along? Culkin
would remember Jackson saying when he mentioned the upcoming
Bermuda trip with his buddy Brock.
Although prosecutors would later suggest that Jackson crashed
the party, Alan Goldstein recalls that the family had been in
Bermuda for a few days and had just gotten off their mopeds
when the hotel relayed a message to please call Mr. M.
The worlds best-selling voice came on the other line.
Well, I just need a break, Jackson explained. Would
you mind? Goldstein, who grew up in Wheaton, started scrambling
to find suitable quarters, until Jackson called back and said
he had it all arranged two suites at the luxe Hamilton
Princess. Goldstein swallowed hard.
I cant afford that, he admitted.
Dont worry, Jackson assured him, everythings
He turned up the next day in his standard red shirt, black
pants, yellow socks and wide-brim hat, Goldstein, now
60, recalled in a telephone interview from his home in Las Vegas.
Jackson invited the gang up to his suite.
Hed brought this huge trunk. He threw it up on the
bed and opened it up, Goldstein says. It looked
like hed raided a Toys R Us. Hes got water guns,
race cars, chewing gum that made your mouth turn black, snap-and-pops
. . .
While Lynn Goldstein mopped up behind them with Turkish towels,
the two grown men and two small boys raced around the suite
in a Supersoaker war.
It was great fun, the Goldstein menfolk now reminisce.
It was a nightmare is how Lynn good-naturedly puts
Jackson came to Bermuda alone, and the role of surrogate-manager
fell to Lynn, who made sure the stars meals were vegetarian
and that hotel management kept away fans. Jacksons trip
made the local press, and then the international media.
For nearly two weeks, first in Bermuda and then back in Orlando
at Disney World, the Goldsteins found themselves immersed in
the other world of stardom with a benefactor they considered
both weird and wonderful.
But with Jackson on board, dreams of sunny days on the beach
disappeared, and they all became Vacationers of the Night,
venturing out in the wee hours to protect Jackson and Culkin
from being mobbed. That meant 2 a.m. dips in the hotel pool,
room service instead of restaurants, shopping trips arranged
after stores closed to the public.
Jackson tried to compensate for the inconveniences.
We were talking one day about how it might be fun to try
diving, Alan Goldstein said, and next thing you
know, weve got a dive boat to ourselves with some dive
masters to teach us.
When the family wanted to see a variety show at one of the islands
resort hotels, the cast put on a private performance at 1 in
the morning in an otherwise empty auditorium, the Goldsteins
said. There was a Michael Jackson impersonator, which
was a little awkward, but Michael was fine with it, says
Brock Goldstein remembers the once-in-your-lifetime
excitement of his favorite music star suddenly becoming a playmate.
He remembers Jackson pulling out a small laser light and taking
the boys out on the balcony to shine the beam down on bewildered
Wed try to get them to follow it, Brock recalls.
Wed be calling out: Follow the red liiiiight,
follow the red liiiight. The red light has a present for you!
Look, its a red balloon! The three would
then hurl water balloons at their targets, ducking behind the
balcony to collapse in laughter.
The vacationers headed back to Orlando, where the Goldsteins
then lived, and holed up in separate suites at a Disney World
hotel to enjoy the theme park for a week.
Summer after summer drifted by. The Goldsteins tucked away their
photo albums and lost touch with both Jackson and Culkin.
They returned from vacation this week to find a phone message
from a Santa Barbara County sheriffs investigator. What
he wants theyre not sure. But their names have already
become part of the court record in People v. Michael Joe
Prosecutors allowed under California law to introduce
unproven allegations from Jacksons past to bolster the
present charge that he fondled a 13-year-old cancer survivor
cross-examined Culkin last week. Had he not slept in
Michael Jacksons bed? Had he not spent unchaperoned hours
with Jackson at his Neverland ranch? And what, they wanted to
know, about that trip to Bermuda? All perfectly innocent, Culkin
The prosecution team would suggest in their questions to Culkin
that the Goldsteins had been wary of Jackson. Had they not confronted
him about the inappropriateness of giving the child a Rolex
when he greeted Culkin with one engraved From Michael
Jackson? Culkin drew a blank.
So do the Goldsteins.
Nor do they agree with the prosecutions portrayal of them
putting their foot down over Jackson taking Mac on private side-trips
in Bermuda. That never happened, declares Lynn Goldstein,
now 61, her recollection mirroring those of her husband, her
son and Culkin when he took the witness stand. Further, the
Goldsteins complain, no one bothered to ask them what happened
before making their vacation a footnote in a major criminal
Investigators did question them back in 1993, they said, after
allegations surfaced that Jackson had molested a young boy.
They said, We have a victim, we believe him, and
were going to get [Jackson]. He fits the profile.
I didnt like that. I wanted to know what evidence they
had, Lynn Goldstein recalls. She told them then what she
repeats today: Nothing improper ever happened, the kids slept
in their own room in the Goldstein suite on a separate floor
from Jacksons, and Jackson never once tried to get
the guys alone. The boys would have sort of like sibling rivalry
over his attention, and Michaels the one who would step
up and say no, were doing things together, with all of
As a teacher at Laurel High School, and then later in Florida,
Lynn Goldstein noted, she knew the warning signs of child abuse,
and Ive even had to report it on occasion.
She felt sorry for Jackson, not frightened.
During one conversation in Bermuda, she recalled, Jackson turned
to her and said wistfully: You know, kids are different
than adults. Kids are honest with you. You can trust them. I
havent met an adult who has been my friend without ending
up wanting something from me.
He was like one of us, Brock Goldstein says of Jackson,
now 46, and his childlike antics in Bermuda. It makes
perfect sense to me because he never had a childhood. Obviously
hes not normal. He had a twisted upbringing.
Like his parents, he hates the sinister questions being raised
now about a fond memory. Id like to be done with
it, but at the same time, if people are saying things we didnt
say, it needs to be cleared up, Brock says. He figures
nothing will ever top that magical summer when he hung out with
the biggest pop star in the world.
I mean, where do you go from there? he wonders.
And more to the point, who comes along?
In 2006 Macauley Culkin produced a book called Junior.
Speaking to the reviewer David Amsden Culkin says what its
like to be a child star and how he aged in reverse, evidently
in a way similar to Michaels: I have a lot of growing
up to do, he tells me at one point, before correcting
himself, or a lot of growing down. I think thats
probably more appropriate. The stuff of his childhoodwork,
pressure, fame, wealth, marriage, divorcereads like a
checklist of adult milestones. Meanwhile, at an age when his
peers are drifting into adulthood, he is a self-sufficient slacker
enjoying a latent adolescence, not worrying about money or work
or the future.
Im willing to face whatever comes with this, from
critics, people trying to make it more sensational than it is.
This is not a sensational book. Theres no Michael Jackson
references at all, so get that out of your head right now.
Thats easier said than done, given that it was less than
a year ago that Culkin testified for the defense during the
pop stars molestation trial. You know, I didnt
want to get involved with the whole thing, he says. It
was a big, fat mess. I almost wanted to say to him, You
should have known better, just to even have those kind of people
in your life.
When they talk, Culkin always encourages Jackson to get
back to music. You know, call up the Roots, call up the
Beastie Boys, call up Björk. The last time they spoke
was a few months after the trial: He sounded better
. . . He trails off, distracted.
Evidently speaking about Michaels state of mind after
the trial he says: One of the things that I always thought
is that I could have turned out that way. Im a fairly
sheltered person, but I could have just put up a fortress around
myself, bought a big chunk of land somewhere, and said, Fuck
Its a cool little world that
he has, but at the same time, its become a little more
distant from reality.
Young Adult Fiction
What a terrible difference it is between Michael of the 90s
when he and Macauley had carefree fun like two free birds and
the lifeless Michael of the year 2006 just after the trial
But I am happy to hear that Macauley Culkin is still standing
up for Michael and fighting for his good name. Here is some
information about the events this May, 2010:
A Bahraini Islamist MP has called to ban a Michael Jackson
tribute concert, labelling the King of Pop a pimp, child
abuser and a thief whose life should not be celebrated,
Gulf Daily News reported on Wednesday.
Sheikh Mohammed Khalid Mohammed has already successfully forced
organisers to change the venue for the concert, but now wants
it banned altogether, the newspaper said.
Everyone knows that he is a pimp, child abuser and a thief
who stole from the Bahraini royal family, Shaikh Mohammed
was quoted as saying.
Jackson lived as a virtual recluse following his 2005 acquittal
on child abuse charges, and spent some time in Bahrain as a
guest of Bahraini prince Sheikh Abdulla bin Hamad al-Khalifa.
Jackson had been in talks with Bahrain-based record label Two
Seas, owned by Sheikh Abdulla, to produce an album, but nothing
ever came of the deal.
Gulf Daily News said Jackson had signed a contract with Two
Seas and later lost a $7 million lawsuit brought against him
by the label for breach of contract.
This is a Response, allegedly from Macauley Culkin:
Nowhere else in the world would someone be able to stand
up and call someone a pimp, a child abuser and a thief without
a shred of evidence and get away with it.
The fact that the accuser is a Member of Parliament is all the
To make such public statements without any foundation is outrageous
and he should not be too surprised if he receives notification
that he is being sued in the American courts for slander.
Obviously on this particular occasion the MP thinks that by
making these disgraceful and cowardly accusations against the
deceased Michael Jackson, he will in some way ingratiate himself
with the powers that be.
I would only hope that the powers that be in Bahrain are not
so easily fooled, and realize that the MP is tarnishing their
own image by association, and distance themselves from him.
In case there is any doubt, charges of child abuse against Jackson
were never proven.
In addition, the failure of a business deal does not permit
some sycophantic publicity seeking MP to label Jackson a thief.
As for the statement that he was a pimp on what basis
is he making this statement? Maybe its time to put something
a little less potent in the Sheesha.
As if that wasnt enough he then goes on to say that all
singers are empty and hollow. Who is this man and in what century
was he raised?
Beware Bahrain this man, and people like him, are shaping
If I were you I would be afraid. Very afraid.
I wish to thank you, Macauley Culkin.
You are a GREAT GUY and an EXCELLENT FRIEND.
* * * * * *
UPDATE: Here is Larry Kings interview with Macauley
Culkin aired on May 27, 2004 (a year before his testimony at
You should really listen to Macauley and see his amazement when
King asked him What happened at Michaels house?
to which he replied emphatically and somewhat incredulously
at the sinister tone of the question: NOTHING happened!.
He says Michael was often misunderstood because he wasnt
good at explaining himself and that he preferred the company
of children because they treated him like a normal human
being, not God or King of Pop.
And I dont blame Macauley for his unwillingness to take
part in all that circus around Michael. He is just being frank
about not wanting to be dragged into all that dirt (which is
quite understandable). However he did go and did testify
and make a brilliant job there!
KING: Whats the relationship you had with Michael Jackson?
CULKIN: Had or have?
KING: Lets go with had to have.
CULKIN: Hes a good friend of mine and still is. Everything
thats going on is an unfortunate situation for everyone
involved, and you know
KING: When did you first get to meet him?
CULKIN: I first meet him kind of called me randomly out
of the blue, hi, its Michael. Its like hey. And the
KING: This after Home Alone.
CULKIN: This is after Home Alone. I had actually met
him before I was doing Nutcracker at Lincoln Center.
I was playing Fritz, and he came back stage one day. And I actually
met him very briefly and he kind of recognized me because it was
after I had done Uncle Buck. And so, he kind of mentions
something. Than he calls me up kind of out of the blue and its
just this weird, random kind of thing. Why dont you come
over to my house?
Think is, I didnt react to him the way most people did.
Most people are like Michael Jackson, and you know, he was a god
to people. And to me, I knew he was a pop singer but beyond that,
I wasnt one of the fans. I think thats one of the
reasons why we connected was the fact that believe me,
I call him a jerk all the time. I call him a fat head and this
and that and he gets it.
KING: And brother (UNINTELLIGIBLE) to..
CULKIN: Yes. We all did. He was a family friend.
KING: What happened at the house? Thats what all the things
that people are concerned about.
CULKIN: Thats whats so weird.
KING: What did happen?
CULKIN: NOTHING happened. You know, nothing really. I mean, we
played video games. We, you know, played at his amusement park.
KING: Did he sleep in the bed?
CULKIN: The thing is with that whole thing, oh, you slept in the
same bedroom as him. Its like, I dont think you understand,
Michael Jacksons bedroom is two stories and it has like
three bathrooms and this and that. So, when I slept in his bedroom,
yes, but you understand the whole scenario. And the thing is with
Michael hes not good as explaining himself and he never
really has been, because hes not a very social person. Youre
talking about someone who has been sheltered and sheltering himself
also for the last like 30 years. And so, hes not very good
at communicating to people and not good at conveying what hes
actually trying to say to you. So, when he says something like
that people he doesnt quite understand why people
react the way that they do.
KING: Why do you think he likes young people so much?
CULKIN: Because the same reason why he liked me, was the fact
that I didnt care who he was. That was the thing. I talked
to him like he was a normal human being and kids do that to him
because hes Michael Jackson the pop singer, but hes
not the God, the king of pop or anything like that.
Hes just a guy who is actually very kid-like himself and
wants to go out there and wants to play video games with you.
KING: Did your parents encourage it?
CULKIN: They werent against it. It wasnt like they
encouraged it or pushing me upon it. I wanted to hang out with
him and they were fine.
KING: What do you make of what hes going through now?
CULKIN: Like I said, its unfortunate, and you know, its
KING: Do you think its a bad rap?
CULKIN: You know, I think so. Yes. Listen, look what happened
the first time this happened to him. If someone had done something
like that to my kid, I wouldnt settle for some money. Id
make sure the guy was in jail. It just really goes to show as
soon as they got the money and they ran. I mean, thats what
really what happened the first time. And so I dont know.
Its a little crazy and I kind of have taken a step back
from the whole thing, because it is a bit of a circus. And you
know, if the same thing was happening to me, I wouldnt want
to drag him into it and vice versa. So I try my best to take a
distance from it, but like I said he was still a friend of mine.
KING: If they asked you to be a character witness, would you appear?
CULKIN: I guess so, but probably not. Like I said, its crazy,
and I dont really want to be a part of it.
KING: You like him.
CULKIN: I like him and hes a friend of mine. Im not
saying I wouldnt. It hasnt been brought up to me and
I dont think hed want me to either. Just because,
like I said, if the same thing was happening to me
KING: What reaction has happened to you from all of this?
CULKIN: What do you mean?
KING: Do people inquire of you a lot about it?
CULKIN: Sometimes. You know, people always have their opinions.
Its funny. People always talk to me about him, because you
know, Im one of these people who will tell you anything
about my life, really, to get me going. You know, so yes, I mean,
Ive openly and freely talked about him and stuff like that.
But overall, you know, s just a good friend of mine.
KING: You wish him well.
CULKIN: Of course I do.
Full transcript: http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0405/27/lkl.00.html
Thank you Helena for your generosity
sharing your investigation!